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Desex or not that the question of the life....

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Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by tezzymusic on Thu Oct 27, 2011 7:05 pm

Hi all,

I have 2 German Shepard dogs that are at the 6mths old age, and it is the time to decide should I desex them or not. The reason of asking is because they are pedigree and beautiful black coat bloodline (=good bloodline), and I read and asked people (include breeders that bred GSD), they said that for the health point of view, they should be desex or otherwise they will have less problems in their future life than non-desex dogs.

But because they are such a good bloodline, if I wants to use them for (maybe) breeding in future either for myself or AI for other GSD, then I will regret it for desexing them. Crying or Very sad

Confused and deciding timing now!!! :S PLEASE SUGGEST views.....

Cheers,

tezzymusic

Location : South Brisbane
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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by Guest on Thu Oct 27, 2011 8:09 pm

Theres a few things to consider-

-Theres a higher chance of female dogs that aren't de-sexed by 2 years (I think this is the age) of getting cancer
-There's a higher chance of female dogs learning un-desired behaviours due to their hormones whilst they are in season
-There's the whole time they're are in season you have to deal with- like having to separate them, the blood spotting, un wanted mating (it depends on what sex of dogs you have)

I am BIG believer that you shouldn't breed if you don't really know what you are doing AND good bloodlines could mean anything. I consider from experience that a German Shepherd with good bloodlines are from WORKING stock not show stock. Working lines are built to last and I have seen this while working with guard dogs.

Check your dogs health before you breed for things like Hip and Elbow Dysplasia and see what their parents scores were as well if you haven't already

This is my opinion, and I know A LOT of other people stand by their show shepherds.

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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by jonna on Thu Oct 27, 2011 8:53 pm

I de sex all my pets. It's just best for me. Well and for them.

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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by Chase on Thu Oct 27, 2011 9:28 pm

100% agree with animalia. and also to the fact that it cost a lot of money to breed dogs and a long time before you make a profit ( if you do everything properly) you have to have the right set-up, do a lot of research and know what complications could occur when the bitch is pregnant or giving birth.

A lot of breeders do it more for the love of that particular breed rather then the money and usually have years of experience behind it.

Just remember that if you really want to breed there is a lot of opportunities to get it right with other dogs, donít rush into it with these ones just because they are good blood lines, there are many other reasons to consider.
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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by tezzymusic on Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:19 pm

animalia wrote:Theres a few things to consider-

-Theres a higher chance of female dogs that aren't de-sexed by 2 years (I think this is the age) of getting cancer
-There's a higher chance of female dogs learning un-desired behaviours due to their hormones whilst they are in season
-There's the whole time they're are in season you have to deal with- like having to separate them, the blood spotting, un wanted mating (it depends on what sex of dogs you have)

I am BIG believer that you shouldn't breed if you don't really know what you are doing AND good bloodlines could mean anything. I consider from experience that a German Shepherd with good bloodlines are from WORKING stock not show stock. Working lines are built to last and I have seen this while working with guard dogs.

Check your dogs health before you breed for things like Hip and Elbow Dysplasia and see what their parents scores were as well if you haven't already

This is my opinion, and I know A LOT of other people stand by their show shepherds.

I've a boy and a girl and they are from the working bloodline! (But not intending to breed together from them). The breeder bred for the police force. (That's the main key point when we went to buy them). And I agreeing with you for female will have behavior issues when if she is not desex earlier.

I've another female labrador that is desex already and she is the most peaceful dog that will ever see. Nearly all of my friends come and see it and said "she is the most perfect dog that I have ever seen...." Very Happy

So, I don't want my female GSD to have behavior issues but still thinking should or should not desex them (the boy+the girl) or just the girl.


Last edited by tezzymusic on Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:24 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : adding more words)

tezzymusic

Location : South Brisbane
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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by tezzymusic on Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:23 pm

Chase wrote:100% agree with animalia. and also to the fact that it cost a lot of money to breed dogs and a long time before you make a profit ( if you do everything properly) you have to have the right set-up, do a lot of research and know what complications could occur when the bitch is pregnant or giving birth.

A lot of breeders do it more for the love of that particular breed rather then the money and usually have years of experience behind it.

Just remember that if you really want to breed there is a lot of opportunities to get it right with other dogs, donít rush into it with these ones just because they are good blood lines, there are many other reasons to consider.

Thanks Chase,

I know most of breeders breed for the love of it and usually have years of experience behind it, but if didn't have the experiences at really first time then how will the future experiences come? Anyways, thank you for telling me in your last paragraph! "Just remember that if you really want to breed there is a lot of opportunities to get it right with other dogs, donít rush into it with these ones just because they are good blood lines, there are many other reasons to consider." -->Totally agree!

tezzymusic

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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by mutleymanor on Sun Jan 08, 2012 11:50 am

"I know most of breeders breed for the love of it and usually have years
of experience behind it, but if didn't have the experiences at really
first time then how will the future experiences come?"

Good point...I waited until I retired to breed and I waited 5 years for the right bitch. I had to establish a good reputation with the breeder and showed Lily to her Australian Chship before I bred her. I was a first time breeder - you have to start somewhere, but do your research first, as advised.

I drove from the Gold Coast to Sydney for the right dog after I had done extensive testing.
The hip and elbow scores for Louis and Wild Child (plus DNA typing, inheritable disease testing and colour testing were $1500.
Pre mating swab - $150, stud fee $1500, palpation by vet then xray to determine number of puppies more hundreds.
Complications are also possible, including losing puppies or your beloved pet.
We do it for the love of the breed indeed!I also have a contract that buyers sign stating that they will return the dog to me if they choose to part with it. There are many, many hours of work involved - a labour of love. I go nowhere when my bitch is due to whelp and have a vet on standby 24/7. They whelp in my bedroom and I sleep beside the whelping box for the first few nights, but I can hear them at all times - and they do need help sometimes. Of course, there is nothing like the fun of watching healthy puppies thrive and grow, or the smiles on the faces of new owners, many of whom have lost a pet and long for the pitter patter of a new one.
As someone else said - Breeding is not for the faint hearted. But, if no-one bred, where would we get our pets?
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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by B&B on Sun Jan 08, 2012 2:37 pm

Tezz this is my opinion, and admittedly a very extreme one.

Both of my dogs have been rescued from pounds

I strongly believe in less dogs bred = less dogs being PTS at the pounds. I am not saying your pups would go to bad owners. But..

It just makes me very sad that 14% of dogs who end up in the pounds are not adopted and are PTS.

To me it is a matter of setting an moral example as much as anything.

I don't have a problem with professional breeders, selling to responsible owners.

But I can't help but think if just one of those litters was not born, and potential buyers of that litter chose to adopt that's alot of dogs not getting PTS

But like I said I know my view is extreme. So I don't expect everyone to agree, I just like to put my thoughts into the mix!

I certainly don't expect people to stop breeding or stop buying well bred pups!
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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by mutleymanor on Sun Jan 08, 2012 5:03 pm

B&B, you have made some excellent points and we have owned 5 rescue dogs in our time - adored them all!
I got my first registered dog in order to compete in obedience trials, in the bad old days when unregistered dogs were not allowed. I researched extensively and decided on a standard poodle for many reasons. Since then I have gone on to show (for fun! - honestly!) and breed very occasionally.
My buyers are specific in their desire for a standard poodle, so not breeding a litter would,sadly, probably not result in fewer dogs being pts. I have many more enquiries than I have had puppies...


I regularly check for Standards up for rescue and have only experienced numbers up for rescue when there was a big bust of a lady up my way, who had heaps (I think things got away on her).
When you check what is in the pound there are large numbers of cross-bred "working dogs" which are less and less suitable as yards get smaller and people get too busy to give them the exercise they need.

Unfortunately, people do breed without offering information about breed requirements or follow-up support, including a "return policy". Additionally, the reason why so many pound rescues are great is that they have already been assessed by the adoption agency.It is not that they are inherently superior - just that the cream has been skimmed. Sadly, too many don't make the grade and are euthanased.
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mutleymanor

Location : Gold Coast, Queensland.
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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by mutleymanor on Sun Jan 08, 2012 5:04 pm

CC - you are being very quiet on this one Wink
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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by gumsgrooming on Sun Jan 08, 2012 7:04 pm

Meryl I believe you are an exceptional breeder. You have very similar standards like the breeder i got my Sherbet off. If for any reason i cannot have Sherbet any more then Lorraine will take Sherbet back for me.

I believe that every responsible breeder should be prepared to take a puppy back should circumstances change. I'm my opinion if you breed em you are partly responsible for em for life.

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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by B&B on Sun Jan 08, 2012 7:18 pm

Good call Gums. It is a very responsible position to take Mutley. But at the end of the day, if you bring a dog into your home, its for life. And the breeder shouldn't have to do this
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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by GroomRoom on Sun Jan 08, 2012 11:01 pm

Oooo the breeder should be willing to baby sit when necessary:lol: hehehehe hey Merryl!!!!!

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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by Tanyaka on Mon Jan 09, 2012 7:13 am

If you have a boy and a girl, how do you stop them mating on their own terms?

I'll always de sex my own dogs, I think they will be happier and healthier that way and then no accidents will happen. It would be terrible if they got pregnant and then complications arose..

I have so many clients with entire dogs. It makes me wonder how and why!! I thought puppies had to be de sexed before sale.. but anyway, the dogs I see have the twisted legs and bad jaw lines or are just not the best temperament so it worries me that the owners might think it would be a good idea to try breeding from them some time!!
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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by mutleymanor on Mon Jan 09, 2012 9:50 am

Hey Gums is that Lorraine Boyd of Picardy poodles? Very nice lady, though I don't know her well. I believe there are quite a few breeders who will take back their dogs, and no, they shouldn't have to, but peoples' circumstances sometimes change beyond their control, as in illness.
Good one Brooke Laughing. It is very quiet here with only 6 dogs after 13 Shocked.
To stop them mating you must keep them separate at all times!! We prefer to send our boy to a friend for a "holiday" - he loves it.
Puppies do not have to be desexed before they are sold, but some are. I think desexing before sale is too young and affects their development. Remember some breeders let them go at only 8 weeks. (Or younger What a Face.)
If I am going to trust someone with one of my babies I have to trust that they are going to desex and so far all have. I would have no problem selling to someone I trusted who had a genuine desire to show or breed and I would help them. I don't "own" this breed and I won't be doing this forever.
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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by tezzymusic on Thu Feb 02, 2012 12:12 am

Hey guys,

Thank for everyone's contributing to this topic! As I was away from holidaying and just got back on the 23th of Jan and things just kept coming like water pouring. lol.... Therefore, I didn't have lots of time to come up to here to chat with you guys! Miss you guys!! Smile

Anyways, after a REALLY REALLY deep thought about it cos my GSDs are 9mths now, I had decided to went for desexing them! And I had done it on yesterday! (31th of Jan 2012)!!!!!

Still I will miss the whole 'desexing or not desexing' thingy, as I would like to be a breeder for a breed of dog someday!

Lastly, shout out to Merryl, thanks for the advise on "I waited until I retired to breed and I waited 5 years for the right bitch"...etc. You are my excellent teacher and friends! Will look up on you forever! Smile

tezzymusic

Location : South Brisbane
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desexing or not from another point of view

Post by Paws 'n All on Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:28 pm

Hi people although I am brand new on this forum I would like to add to all these good comments that if you never want to breed and leave your dogs entire there are some medical risks involved which deserve some consideration as well.
For male dogs not sterilised there is the risk of prostate problems;
for females there is the risk of developing mammary tumors and pyometra in which case (pyometra) the bitch would have to be sterilised anyway.
Just food for thought as I am very passionate about sterilising dogs if you know 100% you don't want to breed from them.
When you sterilise them at a young age they hopefully - there is never a guarantee though - haven't learnt unwanted habits, are more settled and won't wander as much.
Cheers
cheers
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Re: Desex or not that the question of the life....

Post by DogMAN on Wed Dec 12, 2012 5:07 pm

hi,

For me it was a hard decision but the vets medical advice won through.

However that aside, I think something that a lot of people dont consider is that the sexual drive and aggression of a 'standard' dog is likely to be higher if it is not desexed. Unless dogs are allowed off lead regularly they will often become unsocial. This is very dangerous for fighting and guard type dogs.

Good luck.

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